My stock 16s are getting track rubber,
the 17s I have are getting DD rubber.
Recommendations for either?
I'm looking at dunlop star specs for the 16s as they come in the same size as the car had stock
for the 17s I wanted general exclaim UHP's but they're not available in the stock size. I'm guessing this doesn't actually really matter as long as I can get something that fits in the wheel well, right? My 14s (for winter) are off by about 5% on the speedo (they read 5% faster than actual speed).
honestly I don't know dick about tires. all I know is I had general exclaim UHP's as my past DD/Track tire and I liked em for DD not as much for track hence why I'd like to get em again for DD rubber on the 17s.
Halp?
Exclaim UHPs are discontinued, so they're getting hard to find.
If you are going to DD the 17's, I'd say look at a longer life tire. I'm running Yokohama Avid Envigors on the Focus and Mazda, and love them (all-season ultra high performance). Continental DWS is another good option. Both will hold up to spirited driving, and handle very well.
By track rubber, do you mean open lapping, or auto-cross?
(04-22-2012, 09:59 AM)Mystake Wrote: [ -> ]My stock 16s are getting track rubber,
the 17s I have are getting DD rubber.
Recommendations for either?
I'm looking at dunlop star specs for the 16s as they come in the same size as the car had stock
for the 17s I wanted general exclaim UHP's but they're not available in the stock size. I'm guessing this doesn't actually really matter as long as I can get something that fits in the wheel well, right? My 14s (for winter) are off by about 5% on the speedo (they read 5% faster than actual speed).
honestly I don't know dick about tires. all I know is I had general exclaim UHP's as my past DD/Track tire and I liked em for DD not as much for track hence why I'd like to get em again for DD rubber on the 17s.
Halp?
I'd go the other way 'round - 16s for the street and 17s for the track.
For the track: Kumho Ecsta SX or Falken RT-615K for the track (DOT approved means you can drive them to and from the track) - 215-45-17 ... or for a bit more $ and even more grip the Nitto NT-01.
For the street: Kumho Ecsta AST or Falken Ziex ZE-912, for a bit longer lasting tire with good grip, or for a bit more grip but less km the Nitto NeoGen VR or the Dunlop Direzza DZ101 or the Falken FK-452.
My experience with dozens of sets of Falken tires has been flawless - zero defects, they balance perfectly and never had one problem with tread shifting or carcass separation. IMO fantastic value for the money.
My last 4 sets of track tires have been Falken RT-615 (and now the later 615K) and they have given me the best combination possible of grip, longevity, and lots of predictable feedback at the limit of adhesion.
While I don't completely disagree, Ken, I agree with Luc in using the stock 16" rims for the track, and the 17" rims for the street.
From his sig, he has TSW Revos, which in 17" size are roughly 25 lbs a piece, vs. the 16"s at 19 lbs each. 6 lbs of unsprung weight per corner is a good chunk. Plus, in using the 16s, he'll have cheaper tires to replace when he inevitably burns through them on the track.
As for the street tires, I'd recommend against the Kumho Ecsta ASTs. I've been running them for a few years, and replaced them with the Yoko Envigors last summer. Night and day difference in tires, and not too much more money. If you need to go for a more 'cost effective' all season, go for the Falken ZE-912.
(04-23-2012, 11:14 PM)reldridge Wrote: [ -> ]While I don't completely disagree, Ken, I agree with Luc in using the stock 16" rims for the track, and the 17" rims for the street.
From his sig, he has TSW Revos, which in 17" size are roughly 25 lbs a piece, vs. the 16"s at 19 lbs each. 6 lbs of unsprung weight per corner is a good chunk. Plus, in using the 16s, he'll have cheaper tires to replace when he inevitably burns through them on the track.
As for the street tires, I'd recommend against the Kumho Ecsta ASTs. I've been running them for a few years, and replaced them with the Yoko Envigors last summer. Night and day difference in tires, and not too much more money. If you need to go for a more 'cost effective' all season, go for the Falken ZE-912.
Good points, especially about the weight of the 17s - mine are 20 lbs each - still not a lightweight like a Rota, but not outrageously heavy either.
My experience has been that the wider tread and lower profile of the 17 will give more grip and more predictable handling at the limit, and that the best way to make full use of the grip of a track tire is to maximize the contact patch.
My thinking is if going to the expense of a second set of tires just for the track, then go for the maximum contact patch you can.
But truth be told either way for Luc 16s or 17s probably won't make much of a difference - at least not until experience and horsepower demands the utmost from the tires.
Having said that - perhaps Luc you could learn more by simply driving the track on your street tires.
Last year I "borrowed" a 2012 Focus with 18" rims and sport handling package for a track weekend at Mosport ... and aside from inflating the Continentals to 44 lbs it was stock. Could I have gone faster with track tires - probably - but the biggest impediment was horsepower. Nonetheless the grip provided by the street tires was quite remarkable.
I would take the Yokohama Avid Envigor for daily (never really had a track tire). they are great for daily driving in wet and really quite on the highway (compared to my Dunlop SP Sport Maxx).
David
it was suggested i look at the dunlop star specs which is why I was leaning towards them
keep in mind, for the DD tire, I only need summer/rain as I have a set of goodyear nordics on 14s for winter. Anyone else on recommending the yokohama envigors?
edit: reason im going seperate track/street tire is because I DD 500-1000km a week and I'm also going to be doing lapping this summer (doing a school for it, hopefully will be good enough to get signed off to go solo for future lapping events) but also for autocrossing too. ive got the extra rims laying around so why not?
(04-25-2012, 10:54 PM)Mystake Wrote: [ -> ]keep in mind, for the DD tire, I only need summer/rain as I have a set of goodyear nordics on 14s for winter.
The issue with going with a 'dedicated' summer tire is days like this past Monday. You still get freaky weather in Ottawa until May, meanwhile your snow tires are packed away nicely. The Envigors on the Focus didn't miss a beat, and were almost as good in the slush as the Hankook iPikes I ran all winter.
Another reason is tread life. Once you go to a summer tire, you get a softer compound, and less life. With the Engivors and the Continenal DWS, you get treadwear ratings in the 500s, where if you go with their summer tire counterparts, you get treadwear in the 300s, which then translates to 1 or two less years of usable tread, depending on driving.
My General Exclaim's lasted me two summers, with only a few autocross events. They were great in the rain, great on dry but only as a DD. With that said, they were decent in the slush we just had (despite being down to the wear bars)
so yes I want a dedicated summer tire but one that's good in the rain, which noisee said they were good in. Honestly if I could get another set of general exclaim uhp's I would in a heartbeat.
Go for the Envigors, you won't be disappointed. They're technically an all-season, but they work just as well as any summer tire I've ever had.
Cool!
I forgot to answer a question; I am doing open lapping (doing an MCO school in June) and autocrossing. Plan is to be able to go solo at lapping events by the end of the summer