Just curious if there is anyone here who uses upgraded sway bars in the winter (snow/ice/slippery road conditions). Would stiffer sway bars decrease my ability to control the car in slippery road conditions? or will it help? or will it have no effect...
My vehicle is an se wagon, and all other suspension components are stock. I know that you guys know how bad the roads can get here before (and sometimes after) the plow/salter does it's job.
Welcome to the site ... are you talking about upgrading both, or just the rear? You say "bars" plural so I assume you mean front and rear.
I'm no expert but it seems to me that in slippery conditions you'll lose traction at the wheel long before you'll experience any effect of the stiffer bars ... so my bet is on "no effect" ... especially since you are upgrading both front and rear.
Having said that ... in terms of safety the SE sedan has no rear bar at all and I don't believe that the SE sport or ZTS (which have rear bars) experience any difference in handling the slippery stuff. So even if you were upgrading just one or the other, I believe the answer would be the same.
Cheers
grandskam,Aug 22 2007, 03:31 AM Wrote:Just curious if there is anyone here who uses upgraded sway bars in the winter (snow/ice/slippery road conditions). Would stiffer sway bars decrease my ability to control the car in slippery road conditions? or will it help? or will it have no effect...
My vehicle is an se wagon, and all other suspension components are stock. I know that you guys know how bad the roads can get here before (and sometimes after) the plow/salter does it's job.
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get some sticky tires first
As long as you're running great all-seasons or better yet dedicated snows, you should be fine. The tires will still let go long before the sways cause you to break loose.
don't worry about it.. buy the bar!
I am curious though if the stiff sway bars will cause the slippage to happen sooner or more often since the weight is transferred more efficiently from one side to the other and the chassis is more rigid...
grandskam,Aug 22 2007, 04:55 PM Wrote:I am curious though if the stiff sway bars will cause the slippage to happen sooner or more often since the weight is transferred more efficiently from one side to the other and the chassis is more rigid...
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it might FEEL different from the driver's seat but the wheels will slip at the exact same time no matter how you change your suspension... as others have said.. the point of slip depends on your tires
I had the same questions because I heard the swaybars make your rear end slide out more in the snow. But I guess if you do both it should be ok
naz,Aug 22 2007, 04:27 PM Wrote:don't worry about it.. buy the bar!
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Fine, twist my rubber arm why don't you :P
i just did purchase it. Brand new 28mm bar (with bushings and hardware) for $99. If anyone else is interested in grabbing one PM me.
grandskam,Aug 23 2007, 05:43 AM Wrote:naz,Aug 22 2007, 04:27 PM Wrote:don't worry about it.. buy the bar!
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Fine, twist my rubber arm why don't you :P
i just did purchase it. Brand new 28mm bar (with bushings and hardware) for $99. If anyone else is interested in grabbing one PM me.
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heheheheeh np man! hope the install goes well
i haven't been keeping up with focus tech.. but 28mm sounds like a pretty big bar... everything else is stock so you should be ok for now..
but i think some serious research is needed before you buy different springs though.. most spring sets have a rearward bias so that big bar plus stiffer rear springs might in fact make it more for real tail happy
naz,Aug 23 2007, 05:44 PM Wrote:heheheheeh np man! hope the install goes well
i haven't been keeping up with focus tech.. but 28mm sounds like a pretty big bar... everything else is stock so you should be ok for now..
but i think some serious research is needed before you buy different springs though.. most spring sets have a rearward bias so that big bar plus stiffer rear springs might in fact make it more for real tail happy
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the bar is as big as they come I think...
Ya, I was going to keep my rear springs stock since I sometimes have a 400+ lbs load (audio equipment/instruments).
You're all wrong. Stiffer suspensions in general, decrease grip in winter conditions.
And that 28mm rear bar is rediculous. Good luck with that. Please don't tailgate me.
Also a warning, that bar, with a stock suspension is likely to cause your rear control arms to fail.
If the rear comes out just nail the throttle with some sticky winter tires. That'll bring it back.
Hmmm... this may explain why my cars ass wants to pass me on slick road surfaces, like ice.
It is extremely surprising when it happens. You just feel the back go to the right then to the left. Have to be carefull not to react to it with a hard stearing correction or you might end up in the ditch!
My ST has the OEM sway bar... but I'm also thinking my alignment may be off. Tire wear seems ok though, so I'll have to investigate this some more.
P-51,Aug 31 2007, 08: Wrote:You're all wrong. Stiffer suspensions in general, decrease grip in winter conditions.
And that 28mm rear bar is rediculous. Good luck with that. Please don't tailgate me.
Also a warning, that bar, with a stock suspension is likely to cause your rear control arms to fail.
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I figured that it would give me some oversteer, so that's OK. The 28mm bar is really not rediculous at all, it is very effective. I have heard about the lower control arms failing though. Thing is, I don't drive it like it's an SVT, I drive normally, I just wanted some more stability when I have the wagon loaded up, and it has work perfectly. Also, I don't tailgate anyone, so you don't have to worry about that, but I may hunt you down and tailgate you just because you don't want me to ;)
a 28mm bar in the rear, if you havent upgraded the front to at least 25mm will give u big oversteer in limited traction situations. I have a 25rear bar with 22front (stock SVT) and i get oversteer when i auto-x in the rain. a 28mm bar would be harder to control.
in fact, unless u experience alot of understeer, i wouldnt reccomend changing the rear bar at all.
on a side not, lots of people seel there SVT rear bar. 1 can be found used for <100$ easily.
^^ yes, I am going to purchase a 22mm front bar to help out, although I havn't noticed any negative steering characertistics yet, but no snow has fallen so...
I am really happy with the 28mm rear bar actually. Addco says a 22mm+ front bar will correct any oversteering caused by the rear bar. I should be set once that is in.
Yes, the 28mm rear bar is rediculous, and no serious performance drivers are using them. You are basically taking the wonderful independent rear suspension that Ford worked so hard to give us, and locking it up so it can hardly move.
As for the control arms failing, it doesn't have much to do with how you drive. It's just a matter of time, and the roads you drive on. Every time one wheel hits a bump, your control arm now flexes more than it was designed to, it's taking all the load.
I don't even recommend 25mm rear bars unless you also have stiffer springs and shocks.
How do you figure you're getting "more stability" from this? It makes it oversteer more. I also have a wagon and probably load it more than anybody else (full trunk, rooftop basket, towing a trailer) and there are no stability problems.
P-51,Sep 10 2007, 04: Wrote:Yes, the 28mm rear bar is rediculous, and no serious performance drivers are using them. You are basically taking the wonderful independent rear suspension that Ford worked so hard to give us, and locking it up so it can hardly move.
As for the control arms failing, it doesn't have much to do with how you drive. It's just a matter of time, and the roads you drive on. Every time one wheel hits a bump, your control arm now flexes more than it was designed to, it's taking all the load.
I don't even recommend 25mm rear bars unless you also have stiffer springs and shocks.
How do you figure you're getting "more stability" from this? It makes it oversteer more. I also have a wagon and probably load it more than anybody else (full trunk, rooftop basket, towing a trailer) and there are no stability problems.
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Wait, the sway bar makes the chassis more rigid, not the suspension. Also the control arms move freely regardless of bumps. regardless, I plan on reinforcing them tomorrow when I get the oil changed. Not a big deal really, but your posts make you sound like you're stressing out LOL, and no I'm not a serious performance driver, nor do I pretend to be, or want to be. The bar was not for racing purposes. Oversteer shmoversteer lmao, I won't really know until winter so I'll see what it's like with snow rubber, and then go from there. It's easy to swap out so maybe I'll just use it in the summer if it's terrible in the snow...either way it's
not rediculous lol don't be such a negative nancy all your life :o
P-51,Sep 10 2007, 04: Wrote:How do you figure you're getting "more stability" from this? It makes it oversteer more. I also have a wagon and probably load it more than anybody else (full trunk, rooftop basket, towing a trailer) and there are no stability problems.
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From the sounds of it, you do a lot of open road country driving. What with a trailer and all. 95% of My driving takes place in the GTA and downtown T.O.. In other words, quick thinking and sometimes quick steering and or braking. The sway bar helped dramatically because the car is more responsive.