[winnipegkevin]

Looking for input for what direction to take with this situation. This could be a long story, so get a beverage and relax.

I have an '03 SVT. Currently 45k on the odometer. This car has been a real nightmare for me. For the past 3 summers, it has a problem of stalling and dying when the temp gets hot out (28 deg typical, but maybe 24 deg if I drive it a lot over the course of the day). It happens about 5 to 8 times a summer, almost always on the way home from work. Luckily, many times it has happened very close to home, so I can limp it home slowly or leave it and go back and get it later, when it cools down. It will do with stop and go traffic or clear roads.

It has gone to 2 dealers and one garage. Both dealers said they believed it was the fuel pump, but could not replicate the issue. The 2nd dealer changed the fuel pump and fuel filter. Did not work. The 2nd dealer looked at it numerous times after that and could never find a cause. Suggested I get another new fuel pump installed, which I never did.

The MAF was replaced along with the O2 sensors.

The tech at the garage that I have taken it to lately, says it appears to be running lean, which is overheating things and the car is shutting down. The fan resistor, and coolant temp sensor were changed and several cooling fan relays. No change. The latest work was done when I had the car towed in to the shop and they could hear it running poorly. He believed the timing could be off, and found that the spring in the intake gear for the VCT was not functioning properly. Ordered parts and 3 weeks later the car was back on the road. Driveability improved in most regards but 3 days later it died again. It is going back in Monday for more investigation.

Options:
1. Keep dumping money into it to find the cause of the problem. This has not worked so far.
2. Save it for a winter car, when it drives fine due to temp and find a new summer ride. My wife does not like this idea due to storage space.
3. Trade it in at the dealership when it is cooler out. I don't like this option, because I don't want it to become another persons problem.
4. Wrap it around a pole or burn it and hope for insurance money.
5. Sell it for cheap and let someone with more knowledge, money or patience try to fix it.

The car has STS, ORP, formerly SRI, and Xcal2 tune (most recent from FocusSport). I believe the first 3 parts went on after the car started acting up. I believe the first Xcal2 flash was done before the problem started.

I love the car, but this one has really killed my interest. So, what would you do? What option do you like? What would you suspect to be the problem? Things to check?

Thanks for any input,

Kevin

[hardk0re]

having had so many problems its a tough call, to me it sounds like you've replaced ALLOT of stuff and the problem has not gone away.

Is it really overheating? like are all your temp gauges maxed?

[winnipegkevin]

When the car starts dying the AC will kick out and finally dies and when I restart it the gauge will be buried. The motor is blazing hot to the touch. If it sits for a short time, it will start no problem and its like nothing happened. If the weather is cooler, it might not happen again for weeks. Annoying as all Hell. Also, the car throws no codes for anything, which makes things that much more fun to solve.

[GFXjamie]

i would put factory tune back into car for starters.

are your fans turning on at all? if not then theres an issue right there. the temps they engage at in the tuning could be to high not allowing car to cool down when its hot out.

this happened with an old car of mine when i chipped it, it didnt have any programming in it for the cooling fans and when i would be in traffic, line ups, etc it would start to over heat because no cooling going on.

thats what i would check. im sure its something so painfully obvious and simple. could it also be a thermostat problem? maybe its sticking closed sometimes? just throwing some ideas out there. i would definitely check the cooling system/tuning just in case.

[Frost__2001]

dose the yellow { ! } light come on at all before it dies?

I had a problem in the middle of a very cold winter a few years ago when my car would cut out and die when it was warmed up and driving, in my cars case it turned out to be 3 problems, one was fixed before it happened again the next morning with the same issue,(that was the faulty Thermostat) but it turned out that some of the wires for my cars cooling system were damaged and another section of the same wires were exposed and getting wet, causing the car to think it was over heating, when it was not, and thus the car shut itself down to protect itself.

[ZTWsquared]

(06-19-2010, 04:32 AM)winnipegkevin Wrote: Looking for input for what direction to take with this situation. This could be a long story, so get a beverage and relax.

I have an '03 SVT. Currently 45k on the odometer. This car has been a real nightmare for me. For the past 3 summers, it has a problem of stalling and dying when the temp gets hot out (28 deg typical, but maybe 24 deg if I drive it a lot over the course of the day). It happens about 5 to 8 times a summer, almost always on the way home from work. Luckily, many times it has happened very close to home, so I can limp it home slowly or leave it and go back and get it later, when it cools down. It will do with stop and go traffic or clear roads.

It has gone to 2 dealers and one garage. Both dealers said they believed it was the fuel pump, but could not replicate the issue. The 2nd dealer changed the fuel pump and fuel filter. Did not work. The 2nd dealer looked at it numerous times after that and could never find a cause. Suggested I get another new fuel pump installed, which I never did.

The MAF was replaced along with the O2 sensors.

The tech at the garage that I have taken it to lately, says it appears to be running lean, which is overheating things and the car is shutting down. The fan resistor, and coolant temp sensor were changed and several cooling fan relays. No change. The latest work was done when I had the car towed in to the shop and they could hear it running poorly. He believed the timing could be off, and found that the spring in the intake gear for the VCT was not functioning properly. Ordered parts and 3 weeks later the car was back on the road. Driveability improved in most regards but 3 days later it died again. It is going back in Monday for more investigation.

Options:
1. Keep dumping money into it to find the cause of the problem. This has not worked so far.
2. Save it for a winter car, when it drives fine due to temp and find a new summer ride. My wife does not like this idea due to storage space.
3. Trade it in at the dealership when it is cooler out. I don't like this option, because I don't want it to become another persons problem.
4. Wrap it around a pole or burn it and hope for insurance money.
5. Sell it for cheap and let someone with more knowledge, money or patience try to fix it.

The car has STS, ORP, formerly SRI, and Xcal2 tune (most recent from FocusSport). I believe the first 3 parts went on after the car started acting up. I believe the first Xcal2 flash was done before the problem started.

I love the car, but this one has really killed my interest. So, what would you do? What option do you like? What would you suspect to be the problem? Things to check?

Thanks for any input,

Kevin

A couple of things stand out for me from your description:

Why were the fan relays replaced ... it seems to me either the fans work (no replacement needed) or they don't >>> time to investigate further.

You didn't say whether or not the fans were coming on at the proper temp (especially the high speed fan) ... but double check the parameters on your tune to make sure the "high speed fan" temp wasn't inadvertently set too high --- and of course, putting the tune back to stock would be a good investigative tool as well ... just to eliminate the possibility that the condition is caused by the tune.

Also: I didn't read anywhere about any investigation into the mechanical side of the cooling ... the water pump, t-stat, rad etc ... are you sure you're getting good circulation.

If you were experiencing a lean condition serious enough to do what you describe ... for sure you would get a DTC related to head temps and your car might even go into limp mode ... or is it limp mode your describing as poor driveability ... in any event, limp mode is always accompanied by a DTC so if you're check engine light didn't come on ... it's either burnt out or you didn't trigger a CEL. You might want to use your x-cal to read codes anyway, just to see if there's anything in the memory.

Good luck.

[hardk0re]

About 3 out of 7 svt's I went to see had the fans and rad replaced...

[Jmountney1]

i was having over heating problems with my svt as well.

it would be fine for a week then you would let it sit for 5 sec in traffic or parked and the gauges would max. i never drove it tell it shut down thow. and it never through a check engine light.

also the fan would work some times and not work other times.

it ended up being a exposed wire.

i know that sounds obvious now but i took it to a shop and first i was told that with no check engine light and the problem not acting up at the shop all they could start blindly replacing parts.

so i lived with it

finally i got the car to the shop while it was acting up. still not clear y the fans weren't coming on some of the time and were some of the time.


finally it blew a fuse and then i realized the problem. fixed the wires and now all is good.


im not saying this is your issue but hopefully it helps

[winnipegkevin]

Thanks for all the great comments.

The stock tune is currently being used. I did have a performance tune in last summer to see if it made a difference. It appeared to not matter.

I have not noticed if the ! light comes on. The first one to usually flash is the fuel door light flashes and there is a small hic-up but keeps running. This almost always happens just before it stalls the first time. The stalling increases in frequency until does not start again. And if I pop the hood I can hear a sound like the throttle plate closing and then reopening quickly before it dies.

The cooling system is probably the next thing to look at harder. The tech said that contours have a problem with water pump impellers failing and he thought foci used a similar set up. The system seems to circulate. I have monitored the temp on the odometer and it runs about 88 deg +/- 2 most of the time. It rises when sitting and cools when you start moving or crank on the heat or AC.

The fan relays were checked before the resistor pack was changed. All testing at the garage indicate the fans are coming on at the appropriate temps.

Regarding limp mode...I originally thought of that exact thing the first time I seen the temp rise and looked in the owners manual. The 2nd dealer I took it to said the SVT does not have that capability, even though other Foci do. I did not buy it, hence it has not been there since.

Again, thanks for the input. Keep the good ideas coming. Hopefully this will finally be solved this summer.

[NikiterZTS]

I really do like the option #4 that you posted.

[Jmountney1]

(06-19-2010, 09:52 PM)NikiterZTS Wrote: I really do like the option #4 that you posted.

no no. it has to get stolen wink wink then part it out.

[hardk0re]

Where is it parked, heh...accidently leave the keys in it and consider it gone.

[Drivesthebeast]

My Dad's Contour didn't have overheating issues like yours seems to, but it DID have issue with running properly in certain conditions where it would actually buck and then stall when you used the accelerator. After like 6 trips to more than one dealership, he finally got the car to act up with a tech in the passenger seat. He let the car sit in their lot outisde over night when it was damp and cool, went there first thing in the morning, started it, and proceeded out of the dealer lot with the svc tech with him. He didn't let it warm up much, because he wanted to simulate what it's like trying to leave an intersection or driveway on the way to work. Sure enough, the car bucked and stalled when turning right and trying to accelerate in 1st merging into traffic on Upper James (he left the lot at Mohawk Ford). Then he restarted it and tried to move off again, and it did the same thing. So, the tech seemed dismayed as to what had just happened 2x which they hadn't been able to replicate before, and then surprised when my dad restarted the car, rev'ed it to like 5000K, and dumped the clutch, making the axles hop and start shredding the tires. He pinned the rev limiter on the 2.5 in the first 3 gears (which he had to do, because southbound traffic was about to plow into them from behind). The tech was shocked as to how abusive my dad used the car at the time, and my dad let him know that he's almost been t-boned or worse when trying to turn onto a busy road early in the morning, and the car decided to stall at the worst possible momement.

I know that they replaced the 02 sensors (all of them) like 4 times, the TPS and MAF's more than once, reflashed the computer more than once, replaced the fuel pump, and went through 3 filters. They were NOT able to fix the problem. SO, like yourself, my parents where stuck on what to do, as they loved their car, a Contour SE with a 5 speed, leathers, skirt package, optional rims, and a custom ordered interior (the car had been built in Kansas City, and brought to Canada with an interior like an SVT, but not in a colour SVT's were made in). They ended up breaching their lease with Ford (which took them and their lawyer over 6 months to accomplish btw...). They ended up buying their 92 Topaz GS for $1900, which only needed about $250 to safety, to replace it with.

I'm sorry if the circumstances aren't completely the same, but your thread struck a chord of relevance to me...

Best of luck to you!

[winnipegkevin]

Update:
The car has been at the shop since sunday night. They have not replicated the stalling problem, but it hasn't been that warm here. They tell it is now showing a code for the alternator input. He is working on it this weekend to figure out what that is about. Could an alternator problem cause the stalling I was experiencing? I never had a loss of electrical power at any time that I am aware of when it was stalling. I have little hope in the problem being solved.

I always make sure when they are changing parts, that they keep the old ones for me, since I think a lot of the changed parts are working just fine. Guess I won't know until the problem is solved.

Thanks for all the tales of woe and suggestions, good to know I am not alone with these mystery problems.

[moon111]

Any crack/leak in the plastic on the air inlet? If it starts sucking in outside air it'll act very weird.