[D-Dub]

ANTHONYD,Feb 10 2009, 11:38 AM Wrote:

NefCanuck,Feb 10 2009, 11:34 AM Wrote:Having said that, doing almost any sort of "hardward refreshing" on a PC requires, time, patience, money and a bottle of Tylenol :lol:

NefCanuck
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My point exactly....
I'd also like to raise the point that the Mac I replaced was 9 years old and was still functional. (I actually used it to do real work with) What I'm trying to say is, though Macs are not as "upgradable" par say, they do last a helluva lot longer than a PC.
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This is so true......my photoshop teacher still uses a 4 year old pro and the only upgrade was a stick of ram. You pay a little more up front but save time and money in the long run...


With specs like that you must be doing a little video....

[ANTHONYD]

D-Dub,Feb 10 2009, 11: Wrote:

ANTHONYD,Feb 10 2009, 11:38 AM Wrote:

NefCanuck,Feb 10 2009, 11:34 AM Wrote:Having said that, doing almost any sort of "hardward refreshing" on a PC requires, time, patience, money and a bottle of Tylenol :lol:

NefCanuck
[right][snapback]280830[/snapback][/right]

My point exactly....
I'd also like to raise the point that the Mac I replaced was 9 years old and was still functional. (I actually used it to do real work with) What I'm trying to say is, though Macs are not as "upgradable" par say, they do last a helluva lot longer than a PC.
[right][snapback]280832[/snapback][/right]

This is so true......my photoshop teacher still uses a 4 year old pro and the only upgrade was a stick of ram. You pay a little more up front but save time and money in the long run...


With specs like that you must be doing a little video....
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We paid for it through some freelance work I was doing. We figured this was "found money" so we would buy a computer we normally wouldn't have bought. "Get something that will last us a while"

Maybe now I can retouch our wedding photos.

[D-Dub]

Im just running a black book that is hooked up to a 22" sumsung, but if I could, I would be purchasing something like you.

Retouching eh, I did that all of my 3rd semester. Its nice to know how to do it properly and not have to use some s***ty one touch retouch machine at shoppers OR have a part time uneducated tech at a lab do it.

[NOS2Go4Me]

Actually, the ideal PC is one running Ubuntu 8.04 or better (in my experience), although any recent version of Ubuntu makes you be a USER unless maintenance or installs force you to administrative on the box. The complete lack of software advertising on that setup keeps Ubuntu from being a business or home world threat to Mac or PC in the near term.

In the security world, it's hard to crash @ 100 MPH if you're governed to 30.

It's also hard to get onto the freeway and cause a multi-car pileup if you're restricted to the byways.

The only thing saving Macs from the majority of the worst stuff out there is that virus / script-writers are lazy and are targeting the largest slice of the user community out there - the stupid ones. And 99.99% of them have PCs.

Macs no longer have hardware or exclusive software to keep them "trendy". It's all visual now, all user perception.

And as for the "crashing software" herring... the only software that crashes regularly is badly-ported software from one platform to the next, badly-coded software (can happen in any OS, really) and sadly software that depends on the latest and greatest ".NET framework". I can't even begin to express my frustration at how legions of coders are not even building real programs anymore these days. They depend on MS for their latest "feature fix" and differing patch levels (between code and .NET) can easily break things over and over again.

My MySQL development box is 6 years old, has 512MB of RAM and runs Windows 2000 Server. My webhost box at home is about the same age with a single 1GHz P-III Xeon and my 2nd dev box is a quad-processor 500MHz box with 1GB RAM and 2 RAID arrays for SQL and IIS/Apache.

The type of box (Mac/PC) and age have nothing to do with one another. All consumable parts will wear out eventually and replacements will be unavailable. Anything longer than 6 years is a lucky run, actually.

[Focus man. Focus.]

With all the techy stuff said before I got here set aside (I can't understand any of it). That is one sexy computer. :wub:

[ANTHONYD]

NOS2Go4Me,Feb 10 2009, 01:52 PM Wrote:Actually, the ideal PC is one running Ubuntu 8.04 or better (in my experience), although any recent version of Ubuntu makes you be a USER unless maintenance or installs force you to administrative on the box. The complete lack of software advertising on that setup keeps Ubuntu from being a business or home world threat to Mac or PC in the near term.

In the security world, it's hard to crash @ 100 MPH if you're governed to 30.

It's also hard to get onto the freeway and cause a multi-car pileup if you're restricted to the byways.

The only thing saving Macs from the majority of the worst stuff out there is that virus / script-writers are lazy and are targeting the largest slice of the user community out there - the stupid ones. And 99.99% of them have PCs.

Macs no longer have hardware or exclusive software to keep them "trendy". It's all visual now, all user perception.

And as for the "crashing software" herring... the only software that crashes regularly is badly-ported software from one platform to the next, badly-coded software (can happen in any OS, really) and sadly software that depends on the latest and greatest ".NET framework". I can't even begin to express my frustration at how legions of coders are not even building real programs anymore these days. They depend on MS for their latest "feature fix" and differing patch levels (between code and .NET) can easily break things over and over again.

My MySQL development box is 6 years old, has 512MB of RAM and runs Windows 2000 Server. My webhost box at home is about the same age with a single 1GHz P-III Xeon and my 2nd dev box is a quad-processor 500MHz box with 1GB RAM and 2 RAID arrays for SQL and IIS/Apache.

The type of box (Mac/PC) and age have nothing to do with one another. All consumable parts will wear out eventually and replacements will be unavailable. Anything longer than 6 years is a lucky run, actually.
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^^^^^^^^^

Sorry Adam, but I never needed to pay attention to any of this "jibberish"
I own a Mac and it works.


How can you use a computer where you have to worry about stuff like that all the time??? It would drive me to drink if I was constantly wondering if my machine was getting the required 1.1. gigawatts it's needs to run better than a Mac.

Face it... owning a PC is way more bloody work.

[NOS2Go4Me]

Let's put it this way, and I'll be as nice as I can be given the subject matter at hand:

Computers were never intended for the stupid, the apathetic or the untrained. It's akin to an electronic transport truck loaded full of nitroglycerine for all the real-world damage it can potentially do. That's the reality of it.

Those who can think in truly abstract terms, even (to use a much-abused cliche) multi-task themselves become I.T. guys. We exist because the unwashed masses use every form of computer imaginable. If not for I.T. security professionals, you would all be working in the f***ing dark ages. f*** your multi-processor boxes, your servers and your Macs. Break out the crayons and storyboard, bitches. That's what it would be. Ads would be drawn on walls of buildings and emails would be FRS shouting matches.

Those who can ride herd on those who can't. The trendy "those who can't" use Macs.

Sorry, but it's true. It's not a f***ing toaster, Mac or PC. I'll die happy if I teach basic maintenance and security to at least 1 out of 100 people I meet.

If you required a license to use a PC or Mac that was anywhere near as stringent as our running joke called the graduated licensing system, 85% of the world's computers would be offline for months until users proved themselves worthy. Owning a computer is no more a right than wielding a vehicle; sadly, we let this mistake carry on uncorrected daily and we have been especially lenient for the past 25-30 years or so.

Seriously, I.T. guys everywhere should dedicate a global day of thanks to the lemmings that keep them employed. Want to know how bad "I own a Mac and it works" sounds to an I.T. guy? Blinker fluid and muffler bearings. Same thing for the idiot that "goes on the Internets and the Youtubes, checks their Hotmails", etc.

[ANTHONYD]

NOS2Go4Me,Feb 10 2009, 03:22 PM Wrote:Let's put it this way, and I'll be as nice as I can be given the subject matter at hand:

Computers were never intended for the stupid, the apathetic or the untrained. It's akin to an electronic transport truck loaded full of nitroglycerine for all the real-world damage it can potentially do. That's the reality of it.

Those who can think in truly abstract terms, even (to use a much-abused cliche) multi-task themselves become I.T. guys. We exist because the unwashed masses use every form of computer imaginable. If not for I.T. security professionals, you would all be working in the f***ing dark ages. f*** your multi-processor boxes, your servers and your Macs. Break out the crayons and storyboard, bitches. That's what it would be. Ads would be drawn on walls of buildings and emails would be FRS shouting matches.

Those who can ride herd on those who can't. The trendy "those who can't" use Macs.

Sorry, but it's true. It's not a f***ing toaster, Mac or PC. I'll die happy if I teach basic maintenance and security to at least 1 out of 100 people I meet.
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I'm not stupid. I'm far from it. Especially when it comes to what I do.
Just because I own a Mac, doesn't mean I don't know my way around a computer.

I like what I like, and you like what you like. It's what you know, and Macs are what I know.
They do the job I need with ease so that's what I buy em.

[NOS2Go4Me]

ANTHONYD,Feb 10 2009, 02:49 PM Wrote:I'm not stupid. I'm far from it. Especially when it comes to what I do.
Just because I own a Mac, doesn't mean I don't know my way around a computer.

I like what I like, and you like what you like. It's what you know, and Macs are what I know.
They do the job I need with ease so that's what I buy em.
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Never said "you" were, bud. I just cringe every time I hear that phrase.

[ANTHONYD]

It's all good.

You have to admit though....they're pretty sweet looking. :lol:

[darkpuppet]

NOS2Go4Me,Feb 10 2009, 01:52 PM Wrote:Actually, the ideal PC is one running Ubuntu 8.04 or better (in my experience), although any recent version of Ubuntu makes you be a USER unless maintenance or installs force you to administrative on the box. The complete lack of software advertising on that setup keeps Ubuntu from being a business or home world threat to Mac or PC in the near term.

...

The type of box (Mac/PC) and age have nothing to do with one another. All consumable parts will wear out eventually and replacements will be unavailable. Anything longer than 6 years is a lucky run, actually.
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I'm going to be the first to say this... a PC/MAC is just like a toaster. If you use common sense, such as not sticking a fork in it while it's plugged in, you'll be safe.

I used to be like this. When windows '95 came out, I still went to the OS level to use the DOS copy command instead of dragging and dropping.

but dragging and dropping is much more efficient... my boss at the time actually had to force me to drag and drop... and that helped me realize something... computers are supposed to make things simpler for us.

How many lines of assembler did you write this year? When's the last time you wrote your own malloc function? Because if you typed one line of code and didn't do either assembler or write your own memory allocation handler, then you're no better than the people you're making fun of.

Computers are supposed to be freeing up our time to do real productive work. Not provide engaging puzzles for people to overcome while they eat their cereal in the morning.

And every RedHat and AIX guy in the world would laugh at someone who even suggested using Ubuntu. Ubuntu is nice, but it isn't perfect, and people shouldn't need a degree to get it up and running.

And that's where the Mac OS is so brilliant. They closed the hardware from excessive variationss... they made a static platform and limited the number of variables that can be thrown into the mix. And they were able to build a bulletproof OS out of it. What's wrong with that?

People should be able to just do their work... and that should be the aim of every IT guy out there.

Of course, Apple has made missteps.. like their dithered professional displays (12bit colour depth does not jive with Pantone or Graphic designer's creed)... but the nerds at apple are making machines that make lives easier.

It's like when windows XP came out. I knew a lot of people that finally started using computers for doing things just because of the fluffier UI...

we IT guys are just janitors... we clean up messes, make sure the lights go on, and everyone else can do their work uninterrupted. At least we don't have to clean up vomit.

[D-Dub]

Adam you need to chill out.........that is probably the most craziest post Ive seen in awhile.

Adam I can relate to your argument because I took Computer Scicence and specialized in Network Systems Tech in college, which I later left to pursue a job. When that didnt work out I went back to school, but rather than finish my year up I decided to switch to graphic design...why? because it didnt appeal to me anymore and I liked to design.

So looking from both perspectives I can tell your industry standard is a pc with linux, unix or a windows server, where as mine and Anthony's is Mac with OSX. Sure you can edit using cs3 in a windows environment, but its not as smooth and flawless as using it in a OS X environment. The same way goes for macs, they arent the choice of setting up networks because they dont communicate well with PCS.

I own both PC and Mac, even started off editing on a PC for the sole fact I couldnt not afford a mac, but now that I can and I wont go back to using CS3 on a windows machine.


I think the software engineering and computer scientists are the ones that we should thank.....your just a branch from "their" tree. ;)

[ANTHONYD]

i made a post to show off my new toy an now we're rehashing crap we've been over a million times before.
ugh.

[NefCanuck]

ANTHONYD,Feb 10 2009, 07:59 PM Wrote:i made a post to show off my new toy an now we're rehashing crap we've been over a million times before.
ugh.
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:lol: Aw c'mon Anthony, it's not meant in a mean way (I think :ph34r: )

Seriously though it's a nice looking computer, that's for sure ;)

NefCanuck

[NOS2Go4Me]

NefCanuck,Feb 10 2009, 09:19 PM Wrote:

ANTHONYD,Feb 10 2009, 07:59 PM Wrote:i made a post to show off my new toy an now we're rehashing crap we've been over a million times before.
ugh.
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:lol: Aw c'mon Anthony, it's not meant in a mean way (I think :ph34r: )

Seriously though it's a nice looking computer, that's for sure ;)

NefCanuck
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Anthony - sorry man if your s*** got derailed. It IS purdy, and to some that's all that matters.

Dub - Not going to try to start in on you, but you LEFT CS. PCs and Macs now network nicely because Jobs got his head out of his ass and started properly supporting the RFC for TCP/IP while still embracing AirPort and the like. Networking for the Internets is about more than the OS you run. That's the whole point of a computer network - platform independence for the masses. It just so happens your fabric is 99.99% PC at almost any given location.

As for apps, whatever. Bad ports, like I said, ruin good apps on both sides. Arguing one is better than the other just shows where the coding and testing dollars went (and who the target market is).

I don't thank anyone - just like a top-tier mechanic, we're charged with continually learning new s*** and keeping it all humming flawlessly. It's guys like me that make their s*** look good. Not bragging, but that's the life of a sys admin. It's "here's a system. Monitor it. Secure it. Improve it. Report on it. Make it as friendly as possible." Not too hard eh? Well, most days it's cake but you get my drift.

Steve-o. Click "Install Ubuntu" from the CD boot menu. Done. Answer questions. Done. It's fast AND it's secure. What more do you want? :)

As for Redhat and AIX, who cares? Redhat is Fedora with paid support, same as upper-tier MS paid support but without the user apps for the masses. AIX? I actually had to Google/Wiki that one. Power PC-based? I guess that's where all the old Mac parts went :P

Maybe the guys can split the s*** / my s*** / everyone else's s*** out of Anthony's shiny new Mac thread and we can discuss this further - Handicapped Parking or not.

[ANTHONYD]

It's all good boys.
we've all known each other for close to 10 years now.... I know who's into what, and what to expect.
Strong opinions make good debate.

Always fun...and just for the record, none of the posts were taken offensively.

[Scorcher000]

MAC's are purdy, but to me thats all they are. I have a bunch of friends that have MAC's that are IT Techs and they only use them just to say, "ya I got a MAC." Though they all use the PC's for work, play and other :blink: . The only Apple thing I have is a Ipod, and even that has probs when searching threw the songs really quickly.

Anyways everyone is different and I don't mind the wires and the extras that you can get for your PC to make it specifically yours.

Vista Home Premium 32bit
Acer E700
Q6600 2.4GHz Quad Core
6 GB Ram
500 GB Internal / 320 GB External Hard Drives
Nvidia 8600GTS 256MB DDR3
And for some bling 2 multi speed Blue LED fans. :D

[NefCanuck]

Scorcher,

Erm, you know that Vista 32 bit can't access the entire 6GB of RAM you have installed in that box right? (Limitation due to the 32 bit OS is 4GB, minus .5GB for video overhead) so you're wasting 2GB

NefCanuck

[Focus man. Focus.]

NefCanuck,Feb 10 2009, 10:45 PM Wrote:Scorcher,

Erm, you know that Vista 32 bit can't access the entire 6GB of RAM you have installed in that box right? (Limitation due to the 32 bit OS is 4GB, minus .5GB for video overhead) so you're wasting 2GB

NefCanuck
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PWNED!!!!!! I have no idea what you are talking about. I really don't. :blink:

I just built an 80gb external HD with a spare hard drive and a HD box kit for $24.95, now I can take my porn everywhere. :lol:

[NOS2Go4Me]

Dan's right. I'm sitting here squandering .5GB of my RAM as well due to XP 32-bit. :0 Damn Citrix and not having a 64-bit native (or even 32-bit WoW-friendly) SSL VPN client. That's all that's keeping me from switching to 64-bit at the office.